TRANSCRIPT - RN BREAKFAST - FRIDAY, 6 MARCH 2026

SUBJECTS: Repatriation of Australians from the Middle East, Banning of terror organisations, Iran conflict, Israel President’s visit to Australia

MELISSA CLARKE: Tony Burke, welcome back to Radio National Breakfast.

MINISTER FOR HOME AFFAIRS, TONY BURKE: Good morning.

CLARKE: Now, the government has sent a transport plane and a refuelling plane to the Middle East as a contingency in case we need to evacuate people. Is there any chance that they could then become involved in military action, or are they strictly there for repatriation efforts?

BURKE: Our focus is well and truly on repatriation. We’ve made clear we’re not sending troops into Iran or getting involved in that way.

What we have at the moment is numbers of people, Australians stranded way beyond what we’ve seen in any similar occasion. Ordinarily, not that you can ever describe an international conflict as ordinary, but when something like this happens, normally our process has been to get people to the transport hubs. This time the transport hubs have also been attacked.

We’ve been working with the commercial airlines and, in particular, working really cooperatively with the government of the UAE to get good commercial options for people. The first of those flights landed in Sydney last night, and that had 286 Australian passport holders on it. There’s another one that was meant to land at 6:30am this morning in Melbourne - I think that’s happened - with 155 citizens on board. So, the commercial flights are now starting to come. But obviously, the airlines are having to not only make sure they’ve got planes available but also make sure that it’s safe to fly.

CLARKE: There’s been a bit of frustration from some of the Australians who are stuck in Dubai and other cities in the Emirates who have seen UK expatriates being able to get back home in the thousands and seeing daily British Airways flights scheduled and charter flights from other cities they’ve been able to get to by land, Muscat in Oman, for example. Australians are sort of relying on the commercial availability of Emirates and Etihad flights. Why have the UK been able to secure more flights back than Australia has been able to do?

BURKE: I can’t speak for the UK. What I can say is we’ve been working really cooperatively with the UAE. Our priority is being able to get Australians safe and get them back home. The simple reality is, when you’ve got more than a hundred thousand people in the region who have been stranded, a charter flight option isn’t going to scratch the surface on that. You really need to rely on the commercial airlines. As I say, overnight and this morning that’s now started.

CLARKE: Some of those flights, though, aren’t full. We’ve had photos sent to the ABC of some of those flights with a number of empty seats on them. What’s going on?

BURKE: I don’t have information on that, I’m sorry. I know that we’re working with the airlines, working with the UAE to try to get Australians home safely as soon as we can.

CLARKE: All right. I want to turn to another issue. We have had Hizb ut-Tahrir listed as a proscribed hate speech organisation. Can you take me through the final stage that’s now seen that happen to Hizb ut-Tahrir? That’s very much from the legislation that government passed early this year following the Bondi terrorist attacks.

BURKE: If I can sort of explain what all this is about. Traditionally in Australia we’ve only been able to ban organisations if they went all the way to calling for violence and satisfied the definition of being terrorist organisations. Mike Burgess, the Director-General of ASIO, had been making clear there were two organisations in particular who he was worried about that were falling just short of calling for violence, but he believed their rhetoric and their hatred, was providing a pathway for others to be engaging in violence and thought it was a real risk. Those two organisations that he was referring to were the Nazis and Hizb ut-Tahrir.

When we put the legislation through, the Nazis disbanded the day before it came into effect, there is not an organisation to ban there at the moment. With Hizb ut-Tahrir, we got the recommendation from ASIO. Ministers don’t have now unfettered powers to ban organisations; nothing can happen unless ASIO start it. The advice arrived from ASIO, and then you need one of the Ministers to make a decision as to whether or not the group has engaged, prepared, or assisted in what’s defined as a hate crime. If the answer to that is yes and there’s a view that banning them would provide general protection for the rest of the country, then the banning can happen, and that takes effect today.

CLARKE: Are you expecting a legal challenge to that?

BURKE: Everything I do gets challenged in the courts. The moment you take on this particular job, you become the most litigated person in Australia. I’ve got no doubt that it will be challenged, everything I do gets challenged in this area. But we’ve been very confident of our legal position.

CLARKE: When it comes to the National Socialist Network, as you said, they disbanded when this legislation first came up. But are you keeping an eye on them? Because those individuals don’t disappear, and I presume their communication doesn’t disappear either. Are you keeping an eye on where they might re-form?

BURKE: Our agencies are doing all the surveillance that the Australian people would expect here. One of the things I think has really changed, Australia hasn’t always had this view. My history of fighting with Hizb ut-Tahrir goes back 20 years. Back then, the then Liberal Government, when I was first elected, was letting their leader come on speaking tours of Australia, giving him visas, they were being invited into the Australian Embassy. It was a very different view that the government was taking back then. I think there’s now an acceptance, even though this legislation broke the Coalition apart, there’s a general acceptance from Australians that there is a level of hatred and dehumanising language that does provide a pathway for violence, even if it’s not using the words “violence”.

CLARKE: We’ve seen Nine News reporting that two Australian sailors were on board the American submarine that sank an Iranian frigate. Can you confirm that?

BURKE: You’re right to put the question to me, but you’ll respect I’m sure, that we don’t confirm the location of Australian military personnel on any operation that our allies might conduct.

CLARKE: Can you see that it might create some confusion in the Australian community when the government says Australia isn’t involved in these military actions, yet ADF personnel might well be? How do you draw that distinction of saying we’re not involved when some of our uniformed soldiers may well be?

BURKE: I’m not sure how I can answer that without answering the first question, which I’ve said that we’re not in a position to do. Australia, when we have our own assets that are under our command, it’s very clear that we’ve made the point that we’re not going to be involved in the conflict in that particular way. But I can’t confirm the first principle that you’ve put there, so therefore, it’s hard to go to the next stage of that question.

CLARKE: On the broader principle, then, for the government, the key of when Australia is involved in a military action revolves around the asset or the hardware rather than individual personnel, is that a fair principle --

BURKE: It goes to whether or not Australia is directing it and we’re certainly not directing any involvement in this conflict.

CLARKE: All right. You’re listening to Radio National Breakfast. My guest is the Minister for Home Affairs, Tony Burke. We’ve covered a number of issues, but there’s another one I do want to get to, which is the visit of Israel’s President Isaac Herzog to Australia in recent times to support the Jewish community following the Bondi terrorist attacks. Why was President Herzog visiting the domestic spy agency ASIO if he was here for a pastoral role with the Jewish community?

BURKE: When you get dignitaries or Ministers visiting from other countries, they make their requests for who they want to have conversations with and who they want to meet with. It’s not unusual for requests to come through for security agencies. Obviously, I meet with foreign security agencies, they’re always on my list when I travel. But when someone makes a request, then if it’s possible for a meeting to be conducted, a meeting is conducted.

CLARKE: Does that give this visit by Isaac Herzog a different nature than what the government had expressed when it was reassuring the community his visit was only for the purposes of offering support to the Jewish Australian community in their mourning?

BURKE: I think people would be reading too much into simply having a conversation at ASIO. There are security partnerships that happen all around the world. They keep people safe. Those sorts of engagements are important, and I wouldn’t read anymore into it than that.

CLARKE: All right. Thank you, Tony Burke, for speaking to me this morning.

BURKE: Okay. Great to talk to you. See ya.

ENDS